Full Version: Flexible Laser Mask?
From: Engravin' Dave (DATAKES) [#1]
19 Mar 2005
To: ALL
All,
Are any of the laser masks more elastic than others? Such a product feature could aid tremendously with the challenges that compound angles present on items such as wine glasses, although too severe an angle could take the laser out of focus anyway. Often times, placement of photo resist films on this type of item can be difficult.
From: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#2]
19 Mar 2005
To: Engravin' Dave (DATAKES) [#1] 19 Mar 2005
David,
I wonder if there would be a way to laser a mask (on some sort of carrier), then apply it to an item with a curved surface?
David "The Stunt Engraver" Lavaneri
DGL Engraving
Port Hueneme, CA
From: Engravin' Dave (DATAKES) [#3]
19 Mar 2005
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#2] 19 Mar 2005
David,
The carrier sheet is what makes normal photo resists difficult to place on many wine glasses and vases. The carrier sheets I am familiar with are not elastic at all.
From: precisionlaser [#4]
20 Mar 2005
To: Engravin' Dave (DATAKES) [#3] 20 Mar 2005
The carrier sheet needs to be stiff in order to maintain the shape of the mask...otherwise, when you apply it, it could get distorted. I think the concept of an elastic carrier runs directly contrary to its purpose.
Mark
From: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#5]
20 Mar 2005
To: ALL
Good Moring everyone,
The quest continues.
In exploring websites I found myself at Etchmasters.com ( Norm and Ruth Dobbins site). I was exploring their seminar page, and one of the classes talked about resists. One of the resists they talked about was a "liquid" resist.
From my limited perspective this would solve a great deal of problems. Has anyone heard of it?
Thanks
From: precisionlaser [#6]
20 Mar 2005
To: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#5] 20 Mar 2005
PhotoBrasive has a product called SBX Liquid Resist Emulsion that they are probably talking about. I think EtchMaster is a reseller for PhotoBrasive on some things. See http://www.photobrasive.com/sbx.html
Mark
From: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#7]
20 Mar 2005
To: ALL
Hello Everyone,
Not to rub it in, but I just got back from a whale watch in Maalaea Bay. Lots o whales and close up too......it was pretty cool, BUT what was REALLY exciting was to get home and try my experiment.
I picked up a spray can of a product called Plasti Dip. It is typically used to coat handles of tools to give them a rubber coating to give you a better grip on the tool, ( get out of the gutter boys ...{insert laugh here }....or to insulate them from electricity.
Essentially Plasti Dip is a spray on Rubber. You can spray it on as thin or thick as you want. It also comes in a liquid that you can brush on, or use a palette knife on.
I figured, what have I got to lose by trying it, so I masked off the area of the wine glass I wanted to etch, sprayed the Plasti Dip onto the glass, ( think of it as painting) then I let it dry.
The down side is the dry time. 4 hours. ( BUT what else could you be doing while it dried?).
After it dried ( ultimately five hours) I lasered it on a 25 watt, with 85% power and 35% speed. I got a very nice cut. I then blasted it and got a very nice etch. The Plasti Dip rubbed off easily with no water, and there was no blow out from the image or the tape.
Tomorrow I will call photobrasive and order some Laser Tape and talk to them about the SMG liquid.
In the meanwhile I have posted a bad picture of the result ( it is much better in person )using Plasti Dip, ( Available at your local hardware store).
Thanks
EDITED: 26 May 2005 by C_BURKE
From: JHayes55 [#8]
21 Mar 2005
To: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#7] 21 Mar 2005
Well Chuck
That is one whale of an idea. I am so proud of you!!! I have used this
Plastic Coat stuff for what it was intended for but I never dreamed of
Spray-painting it on something. You might have something here -
consider adding a harder/drying agent to help the plastic coat
dry quicker (think patent). Well as I said you are going to be big -
just remember us small folks back here when you reach the pinnacle of
success.
Joe
EDITED: 21 Mar 2005 by JHAYES55
From: Engravin' Dave (DATAKES) [#9]
21 Mar 2005
To: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#7] 21 Mar 2005
Chuck,
As I said in my e-mail to you, this is an interesting and worthwhile concept. I like the idea.
I wonder how many glasses you can get out of one can of Plasti Dip.
What was the odor like when you lasered the PlastiDip?
I wonder if there are any toxicity issues with the lasering of this material. This would be worth confirming.
ÂÂÂÂÂ
EDITED: 21 Mar 2005 by DATAKES
From: UCONN Dave & Lynn too (DANDL48) [#10]
21 Mar 2005
To: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#7] 21 Mar 2005
Chuck,
You might want to check to see that it doesn't contain any PCB"s.
Dave
From: RickM (FLYER16612) [#11]
21 Mar 2005
To: ALL
From: Engravin' Dave (DATAKES) [#12]
21 Mar 2005
To: RickM (FLYER16612) [#11] 21 Mar 2005
Rick,
Welcome to the forum. I will start a new thread associated with your question about your LaserPro. This question will take this thread off topic.
From: Rodney Gold (RODNEY_GOLD) [#13]
21 Mar 2005
To: RickM (FLYER16612) [#11] 21 Mar 2005
to all:
I use paper application tapes for compound curved stuff. Resists a blast very nicely (carborundum , very fine grit) , lasers real quick (you can even set the power to very low to get a brown marked test lasering without going thru) and it conforms quite nicely , rubs off in a tick when wet.
For real complex stuff we cut panels and apply them. Masking tape works well too
Nice thing about both is that the laser leaves a residue and you know you got a decent blast depth and you havent damged the resist (worn thru) as the residue clears in the blast cabinet , it's plainly visible.
To rick: Which laser did you get. I have experience with the mercury and the explorer.
From: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#14]
21 Mar 2005
To: RickM (FLYER16612) [#11] 21 Mar 2005
Hi Rick,
Welcome to EE. You will find this to be a great neighborhood, and like any community the more you get involved the more you get back. There are lots of great people here with vast experience......I have learned a lot, and made a lot of friends.....
Anyway, as to the plasti dip, there was no weeding. I simply rubbed the dip off with my thumbs when I was finished.
I blasted the glass at 35psi.
From: John (ICTJOHN) [#15]
21 Mar 2005
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#2] 21 Mar 2005
David,
That is what I have been looking for without any luck. I would like to laser (reverse engrave) the mask - THEN apply it to the article to be sandblasted.
I have some curved glass with a photo holder that has too much of a curve to put into my laser and keep it in focus. Let me know if you or anyone else finds a product like this.
From: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#16]
21 Mar 2005
To: John (ICTJOHN) [#15] 21 Mar 2005
John,
That would, without a doubt, be the hot item (laser image, then apply to substrate).
Shelf life of traditional photo-resist is very limited. The laserable mask doesn't have as finite a shelf life (if any at all).
Seems like a variation of Chuck Burke's ("Plasti-Dip") idea on a carrier, could be lased, then an adhesive (spray?) could be applied to the surface and applied to a substrate ala vinyl lettering.
Should be flexible and durable enough.
David "The Stunt Engraver" Lavaneri
DGL Engraving
Port Hueneme, CA
From: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#17]
21 Mar 2005
To: Rodney Gold (RODNEY_GOLD) [#13] 22 Mar 2005
Rodney,
Are you saying mask the glass with TAPE? Then laser and blast?
I wonder why that would not work, since we use the tape to hold the resist anyway. I think I might try just taping a glass and see what happens
From: laserman (MIKEMAC) [#18]
21 Mar 2005
To: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#17] 21 Mar 2005
Chuck,
I think the cleaning after the fact might be the reason. When tape is lasered it gets soft or mushy and then becomes hard to clean not Impossible but difficult.
From: Rodney Gold (RODNEY_GOLD) [#19]
22 Mar 2005
To: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#17] 22 Mar 2005
Yeh , we use el cheapo paper based application tape used in the vinyl sign industry or masking tape - we were told it couldnt possibly work (by one of the top USA based blasting "teachers" who shall remain nameless;) But it works a treat.
The problem is overblasting , IE you cant blast the stuff forever and a day before it wears thru , but it doesnt take a long time to know exactly when to stop (when you see the residue clear).
In a pinch there is another option , but it is not recommended.
Buy polymeric cast vinyl (very thin and flexible) which you can use to wrap over a compound surface (you can actually wrap a ball with the stuff with a hair dryer to heat it) and laser it , it releases Chlorine and this combines with moisture to form hydrochloric acid , both the gas and the acid are bad news for you and the laser but if you really need it , it works.
From: Rodney Gold (RODNEY_GOLD) [#20]
22 Mar 2005
To: laserman (MIKEMAC) [#18] 23 Mar 2005
The paper tapes dont get mushy when lasering them , and cleaning after is a snap , you just wet the glass and all the tape comes off with a light rub.
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