Full Version: Sign Warehouse
From: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#1]
28 May 2005
To: ALL
Is this folder for good AND bad reviews? Or only GOOD? Because I have a review, but it is not good.
Chuck
EDITED: 31 May 2005 by DGL
From: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#2]
28 May 2005
To: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#1] 28 May 2005
Chuck,
The folder is for reviews, excellent and, well...not quite as
Keep in mind, the review must be factual, first-hand knowledge.
No, friend-of-a-cousin's-nephew-in-law's, stories. :P
From: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#3]
28 May 2005
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#2] 28 May 2005
Well David,
Darn it all anywy, my cousins in-law's friend is NOT going to like that at all....
My beef is with Sign Warehouse and the fact that they will not support Corel.
If they are not going to support Corel, they should say that up front, but I was not told that, and did not find out until after I bought my laser from them. This is probably for good reason. They KNOW that Corel is the industry standard, and if they said up front they did not support it, they would not sell many lasers.....
The DO sell that Dog EngraveLab, which is nothing more than a rushed to market version of Sign Lab. Want Proof? Click on help and ask about an engraving problem. Lot's of reference to "SignLab".
However on the EngraveLab ( Laser Pro 6) the DO provide a Corel color palette. THIS tells me that THEY KNOW that the equipment could and probably will be used with Corel....yet they won't help, so end users using Corel are STUCK!
NOT FAIR!!!!!! and under NO circumtstance will I EVER recommend Sign Warehouse or PINNACLE to anyone, and should anyone ask ME, I will most certainly warn them off.
THERE! Now I'm going to go see if my cousins' in-laws friends are interested in hearing that. Probably not. They probably have a stake in Sign warehouse.
From: Rodney Gold (RODNEY_GOLD) [#4]
28 May 2005
To: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#3] 29 May 2005
I think you might be a little harsh , probably the result of staring at installation screens over the last few days ;)
In defense of them , The guys from sign warehouse have been helpful on this board to all laser users regardless of machine and software. The ONLY niggle I had with them was that some employee or sockpuppet was posting as a "extremely satisfied" user on some lesser known boards a while ago but that seems to have stopped VERY smartly.
I don't think the lack of support for a particular package is that material as one can use just about anything to drive the laser - its the print driver that counts and GCC that make the machine DO support corel and may others.
Granted, any dealer should supply a complete package with the laser and train accordingly and they have chosen engravelab. So they do offer a complete solution. I also find some of their support documents re the laser on their site better written and clearer than Laserpros or *shudder* Gcc's (my first explorer manual must have been written by a Tibetan monk who speaks some arcane himalyan dialect and had had a full frontal lobotomy some years before authoring it :)
What I do find that sucks with the GCC drivers is the lack of extremely detailed explanations of the driver features . Another annoyance is fact that drivers are constantly being updated with new wish list features and often the latest driver or firmware has bugs or undocumented features. At least GCc do seem to listen to their users and offer "free" and frequent productivity upgrades with the firmware and drivers and fix bugs quickly.
This case is similar to my digital printer from Roland , a lot of aftermarket suppliers do minor mods and rebadge and sell with a different RIP from Rolands and the problem is that they have niche markets so OEM support and the huge database of documented workarounds and issues are not avialable to those users.
AFAIK , there is no difference between the pinnacle and the bog standard mercury in terms of the machine and driver (I might be wrong) so you DO still have the OEM stuff to draw on.
From: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#5]
29 May 2005
To: Rodney Gold (RODNEY_GOLD) [#4] 29 May 2005
Rodney,
Perhaps you are right. After re-reading my post I agree with you, I may have been a little harsh, however my beef about them not supporting Corel is still valid. ALL the other laser reps and dealers do. I also believe that Sign Warehouse should tell their customers UP FRONT that they do not and will not support Corel.
I had a problem once with a "vector" cut. It was a simple solution. In corel the "hairline" setting needs to be set to .005. I found that out on a "different" forum. The tech support person who I was dealing with at the time, ( a new guy that is no longer with Sign Warehouse ) said to me, " I don't know what to tell you, we don't support Corel"..... Is THAT customer service? I think not.
I believe they should support Corel to the extent that it affects the operation or lack there of of the laser. I do not expect them or any other laser sales rep or company to support corel to the nth degree.
Their two tech support people Kevin Huffman and Eddie Larue are nothing short of MAGNIFICENT! However, were they ALLOWED to help with Corel, I am sure this problem I am having could have and would have been solved long ago.
Chuck
From: Michael [#6]
30 May 2005
To: Rodney Gold (RODNEY_GOLD) [#4] 30 May 2005
They have an ebay auction going today for their Pinnacle M seriese 25 watt laser engraver (auction 7519072209) in which signwarehouse states in very large and very bold text, "Pinnacle M-Series
25 Watt Retails For $12,995 "
However, on Signwarehouse's website, they retail the same engraver at $10,000.00. Here's the link: http://www.engraverswarehouse.com/pinnacle_m.htm
At one time I asked them via ebay's "ask seller a question" link why they were making such statements, and their reply was utter silence.
I've been watching their auctions and website for awhile and neither has changed, so it's not a "just for today special" on their site.
I won't say it's deceptive advertising, but I will say it sure looks that way to me.
From: UncleSteve [#7]
30 May 2005
To: Michael [#6] 30 May 2005
From: Scott [#8]
30 May 2005
To: ALL
They are selling the 25 watt for $10,995.
The price for this model on their web site is in bold, where none of the others are. In fact the 12 Watt is listed at $9,995.
Just because they are selling the 25 watt on their site for 10,995 does not mean that is the retail price. They could be selling for less than retail as a standard business decision for an extended period of time. Millions of reasons for this.
I get plenty of items that say MSRP $19.95 or such, but doesn't mean I have to sell for that. It would not be against any rule to sell on ebay for 14.95, my web site for 15.95 and list retail as 19.95, even if I am the manufacturer.
I don't know signwarehouse from jack, so I am not necessarily defending them, just bringing more light in. :-)
From: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#9]
31 May 2005
To: Scott [#8] 31 May 2005
Scott,
You may not know Sign Warehouse from Jack, but here's forum member, Alex's, first-hand experience:
Hello All
Though I have not posted for a while, I've been in touch with the forum.
This thread has brought out many things which interest me and I would like to comment.
I recently imported a Laserpro 30 W Explorer from Signwarehouse. As far as the machine goes, I have no disappointments so far (2 wks). I have been trying lots of things and the machine has met my expectations gained from research. As far as Signwarehouse.... all indications are for a rough ride ahead!
The machine was shipped without the vacuum blower and the engraving samples as was promised/advertised. Just before the Laser reached the Trinidad Port, I was told by my freight fowarders that there is another 20lb package in Miami from Signwarehouse..... Called my rep.... Rep says fowarder was told to wait for the COMPRESSOR(?) that was shipped separately.....forwarder denies this. Guess who gets to pay the extra shipping cost. Incidently the shipping cost for that package is the same as that for the laser plus an extra duty.
Call back rep.... Did you say compressor? I was expecting a blower as advertised. Rep says you don't really need the blower.... the compressor is the important thing.. ..(see what i have to deal with?).
Anyhow rep says if the blower is not in the package call me back and i will have one shipped.
Package arrives... you guessed it..... no blower and no engraving samples...
Numerous calls...email sent....messages left...and i have not been able to talk to my rep. Prior to the sale it was very different. I finally got in touch with a customer rep to whom i explained the issues. She promised to ship the blower and engraving samples. I explained to her that it will cost me as much as the laser for the shipment and it is unfair for me to bear that cost. Signwareout refused to entertain that burden. I asked to please allow me to change freight fowarders since it will cost me less and would be no extra cost to you. They refused without explanation (it's not our policy).
So i am operating the laser with a makeshift vacuum cleaner. I already had a compressor and have not even bothered to collect the one sent. I am awaiting the blower
Chuck on your stamp problem..... I was able to simulate the problem by narrowing the width (x-direction) of the cut line. I simulated it with your file and a completely separate file I created. Try fiddling with the size of the cut line. I am using corel 12. Driver version 3.48. So it looks like this driver also has a problem or is it corel 12??
Thanks to all for the invaluable info and contributions on this forum
Alex
EDITED: 31 May 2005 by DGL
From: Scott [#10]
31 May 2005
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#9] 31 May 2005
Good points.
I understand they aren't on good standings with a lot of folks, I was just saying that I enjoy good first hand accounts on issues, more along the lines of what you posted, not what I felt was a slick way of making something negative when it may not be. The ebay thing may be legit, or not.
It would be a good point if there were a few more facts to back it up. But no reply from them doesn't automatically assume negligence or guilt.
My opinion only, and I respect all the others.
From: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#11]
31 May 2005
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#9] 31 May 2005
David,
It appears you cut and pasted Alex's response. How can I reply to him?
Alex, if you read this pm me please.
All,
As for sign warehouse, my only REAL complaint is that they do not and will not support Corel 12.
And despite the fact that owner Chris Gripp is quoted in one of his catalogs as saying "We want you for a customer for life, and we will do what it takes to make that happen" he will do what it takes with the exception of supporting Corel.
Again, I have the utmost respect for Kevin and Eddie in Sign Warehouses tech support, but now, probably as a result of my posts here, I have not heard from either regarding my problem, so I am anxious to talk to you Alex about how you duplicated it and solved it.
All in all, I am satisfied with the Pinnacle/LaserPro.....for the value I feel I got a fair shake. I am please with Eddie and Kevin, however I have an underlying feeling of unease regarding Sign Warehouse, and it is unlikely that WHEN I need another laser, I would buy it from them.
Chuck
P.S. how come my signature that David Takes worked so hard on, does not seem to show up?
From: Engravin' Dave (DATAKES) [#12]
31 May 2005
To: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#11] 31 May 2005
Chuck,
Under "My Controls" then "Forum Options"you will find an option that says "Globally Ignore User Signatures". Make sure that it is not selected. During the upgrade to Beehive .5 it seemed to have defaulted this option to ignore signatures. I see your signature loud and clear. Let me know if this doesn't help.
EDITED: 31 May 2005 by DATAKES
From: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#13]
31 May 2005
To: alex (ALEXJ) [#12] 1 Jun 2005
Alex,
I moved your previous post from the "Bizarre Laserpro/Pinnacle/Corel problem" thread to here, because, for the mostpart, it was relating your experience with Sign Warehouse.
Just wanted to alert you to this thread, because there have been a couple of responses to your post.
EDITED: 31 May 2005 by DGL
From: alex (ALEXJ) [#14]
1 Jun 2005
To: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#11] 1 Jun 2005
Hi Chuck
Let me also state again that I am very much satisfied with my laser and with the value for the price. I just feel that I am paying a price for mistakes made by Signwarehouse and i cant even remember if their was as much as an apology for this.
I set up my machine on my own and i'm training myself. I new i had to do this because of my location. I have not as yet required any tech assistance. It also placed less burden on the rep. At the least my package should have been complete. And we all make mistkes but their is a way to deal with it.....I'M SORRY... i mean mistAkes..
Anyhow Chuck, when i saw the problems you were having i was eager to try the stamp mode on my machine.
First I tried your file in stamp mode.....It cut and engraved as it should.
Then i created a completly different file.... send it to print in stamp mode....it cut and engraved as it should.
Then i reduced the size of the stamp, since i was troubleshooting and did not want to waste time and material. My next attempt at the stamp produced only a vector cut. Aha... it's related to size.
After fiddling with size of engraved area and size of cut line in all directions and combinations, It came down to this....When the width of the cut line is decreased beyound some threshold(in the x-direction), the file does NOT engrave, but only cuts. I am not sure how this is related, but it is.
Is it related to the 'SCALE FACTOR' in corel 12? Dont no.
I reduced slightly the width of your file and the same thing happened (cutting and no engraving). Increased it and it engraved and cut as it should. Both files had different threshold value though.
After a while I realised there was no need to actually cut the stamp to know the result. The stamp always engraved first, so once the file is sent and the LASER DISPLAY only shows the vector setting it will only cut. If it shows the raster setting, it will cut and engrave. I did also adjust the pitch in stamp mode to make sure it was not related to that.
Feel free to request any other info on this...
Re
Alex
From: Michael [#15]
1 Jun 2005
To: Scott [#10] 6 Jun 2005
I reallize you want to be spoon fed, Scot, and that is why I posted the auction number (still active) and the Signwarehouse page with their price.
It is what Signwarehouse says, not me.
If you want to call me liar, come on out and say it, but be sure you've examined the evidence first hand.
From: Ken D. (KDEVORY) [#16]
1 Jun 2005
To: ALL
SignWarehouse & eBay:
The $12,995 price can be found on their web site. Its their package special #1. It includes the laser, free delivery, on-site installation/training. (I guess if you pay $2,000 for on-site setup they ship it for "free".) All their "specials" are bundled options for additional $$$ beyond the $10,995 base price.
It's interesting the eBay auction uses that price and lists shipping separately, and doesn't mention on-site anything. It also says "Any SignWarehouse promotions, special offers and/or rebates do not apply to these auctions."
So yes, they sell that laser at the higher price, but it includes more. I don't know the price from Laser Pro for the same unit, or what it includes. I suspect it's more then the $10,995, but also includes more, like on-site setup, or support for Corel.
From: DBarron [#17]
1 Jun 2005
To: Michael [#6] 1 Jun 2005
Michael,
The reason for the difference in the retail price and the price on the website are because it has been decided that it should be sold at a lower price. The suggested retail price is indeed 12,995, however it has been discounted and is sold at 10,995 (hence the significant price difference between the 25 watt and 40 watt). The machine that is 10,000 (9,995) is a 12 watt.
Hopefully that clarifies the situation.
DL
Pinnacle Lasers
From: DBarron [#18]
1 Jun 2005
To: alex (ALEXJ) [#14] 1 Jun 2005
Alex,
I would like to formally apologize for the issues you have faced. I was not aware of those until reading your post here. If there is anything I can do to be of assistance please let me know.
Thank you,
DL
Pinnacle Lasers
From: Michael [#19]
1 Jun 2005
To: DBarron [#17] 2 Jun 2005
It's always been clear.
You state in your ebay auctions the item you are auctioning retails for a different amount from what you actually sell it for on your web site.
Go figure.
If it looks like a duck, etc.
From: Sei (SEIMA) [#20]
2 Jun 2005
To: Michael [#19] 3 Jun 2005
If you go into Suncoast or another movie specialty store you might find a DVD for $29.95. Special features, director's commentary, spanish language track, all sorts of goodies. Seems like a good enough deal, and the $29.95 is probably the manufacturer's suggested retail price.
Now cross the street and go into Wal-Mart, the same version of the same DVD with the same features might be $17.47. This doesn't change the MSRP. It just means that Wal-Mart is able to sell for below the standard retail price.
Sei
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