Full Version: Geo. Knight DK20S - Watch Your Fingers
From: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#95]
15 Mar 2006
To: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#94] 15 Mar 2006
Hi Harvey,
I realize that he didn't threaten with a lawsuit or litigation, but he did threaten them with a personal crusade on a public forum. I was speaking in broad terms about what vendors have to contend with in this day and age.
Frankly if I was Knight, I would be pissed for being pushed to re-design a product that was already safe when used properly. They certainly can't come out and say that because it's not politically correct, so instead they play the lip service game........I am not saying that it is right to do, but I understand why it might happen.
David will most likely get what he wants because it is politically correct,....not because it is necessary.
From: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#96]
15 Mar 2006
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#93] 15 Mar 2006
From: Becky (KIAIJANE) [#97]
15 Mar 2006
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#16] 15 Mar 2006
Dave-
Thank you for your post about your mishap with the heat press. I have a mother who went to the hospital with chest pains...turns out her purse was to heavy and she had bursitis (we now jokingly refer to it as purse-itis) I have a brother in law who went to the ER 3 times because of a neck problem he was having..turns out he had switched pillows. Neither of these people need instructions on a purse or a pillow nor do they need warning labels to use such things. My point is that sometimes things we use on a daily basis can cause injury when you least expect it. As a new heat press owner, I found your heads up valuable and would never question your experience and ego.
Thank you for taking the time to post it.
From: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#98]
15 Mar 2006
To: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#96] 15 Mar 2006
Brian,
Following, is my original email to Aaron. No threat of a forum crusade, here, or in any other communication.
I was approaching him as a concerned "citizen."
At the time, he was appreciative of my bringing this unforseen problem to his attention.
In my most recent email, (8 mos. later) he was less appreciative of my bringing to his attention, multiple incidents of people "nipping" their fingers through "proper" use of the press.
I would rather be threatened by GK, than given empty claims of addressing the issue.
Of course, I don't see what type of threat could be leveled, by my reporting factual experiences, of end-users of their equipment.
You may think I 'have it in" for GK, which isn't the case. I highlighted their equipment in an ARA presentation, "Choosing Sublimation Equipment & Supplies" and would do so again, in any future presentations on the subject.
...................................................................................................................
I'm making contact to alert you to what I see as a design flaw in the DK20S heat press.
My personal heat press is a Hix swing-away model.
I routinely use the center section of the Hix open/close lever (very similar
to that of the DK20S) as a means of stable, one-hand operation, in the
opening and closing of the press.
Last weekend, I was an instructor at a sublimation training event and used a DK20S to create a sample for my presentation.
With my left hand operating the pressure adjustment knob and my right hand on the center section of the open/close lever, I slightly opened and closed the press until I had achieved proper pressure.
I then moved the open/close lever to its full-open position, which resulted in the index finger of my right hand being smashed between the lever and the top of the heat press housing, just above the digital readout.
I've attached a picture of the injury.
I'm not a litigious person and the purpose of this message is not to seek
compensation in any form.
At bare minimum, I suggest a warning label be placed above the digital
readout. Better: A means of limiting the throw of the lever, leaving space for a person's fingers.
To think a situation such as mine hasn't happened before, or will never
happen again, would be short-sighted.
I'm certainly not trying to tell you how to run your business. Just hoping
to keep you out of potential legal proceedings, while protecting the users of your equipment.
Thank you,
David Lavaneri
DGL Engraving
...................................................................................................................
EDITED: 15 Mar 2006 by DGL
From: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#99]
15 Mar 2006
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#98] 15 Mar 2006
"Rest assured, we're on it." says Aaron.
Aaron also said he trusts I'm not seeking to drag this issue too far into the realm of a crusade.
To which I replied:
"As far as a crusade, I'll take your reply at face value. If you're on it, I'm off it."
To which he replied:
"Oh, we're soooo on it!"
Showing he perceives you as someone on a crusade.......requiring him to change it or you'll be back "on it". To me that exchange came across as a threat in which he conceeded. Weather he actually will adjust the press or not will be interesting at this point. He has pretty much pigeonholed himself into doing what you want him to, or getting backlash here on the forum. Like I said before, I feel that you have him by the perverbial short hairs because of your ability to continue your "crusade" here on a public forum. He will have to be politicaly correct and adjust it or you won't let it die......I mean come on...if your willing to go almost 100 rounds with me on the subject.....I highly doubt that he will stop you..... :)
I think you will get what you want.....but I still think your wrong to do what you are doing. I honestly don't think you have any other axe to grind with them, and I believe that this is something that you believe in...not that it's something out of retribution....I give you credit for that....I just disagree.
From: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#100]
15 Mar 2006
To: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#99] 15 Mar 2006
It's not a matter of Aaron doing what I want him to.
It's a matter of him following through on an uncoerced claim, that in the end, will be in the best interest of his company.
From: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#101]
15 Mar 2006
To: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#99] 15 Mar 2006
I do not think you noticed this one, so here goes.
Have you noticed that on cars manufactured for at least the past twenty years, the brake pedal has been redesigned. Do you know why?
From: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#102]
15 Mar 2006
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#100] 15 Mar 2006
From: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#103]
15 Mar 2006
To: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#101] 15 Mar 2006
Harvey....One can only guess that it's because it's "safer"..............
You guys keep bringing up life and death situations and trying to compare them to pinching a finger......This is not life and death unless the finger gets stuck in a press that is sinking to the bottom of the sea.
Why is it that we have to save the world from pinched fingers???!!! Why can't we expect people to understand the equipment that they use, and realize that when using this equipment, that there are inherent risk with using it improperly?......I'm sorry, but it all just defies logic to me. Grabbing the handle where he did is as foolish as putting your other hand under the platen and pulling the handle.......That's how I see it. No one is going to change my mind.....It's clear that no one is going to change David's mind either. I think that the game he is playing in the name of safety is wrong. It's wrong to blame others for something that you did to yourself.
Ever hit your hand with a hammer? Blame it on Stanely? No! Ever cut yourself with a knife? Blame it on exacto? No! Ever cut yourself on a piece of paper? blame it on the paper company? No! Ever burn your hand on a stove? Gee, no stickers on that hot surface are there????? Blame any one of the stove manufacturers? No, you blame yourself for making the mistake....Yes I said Mistake.........You know when you do something that you didn't intend to do with some dire concequences.
Like pinching a finger.
From: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#104]
15 Mar 2006
To: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#103] 16 Mar 2006
From: UncleSteve [#105]
16 Mar 2006
To: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#104] 16 Mar 2006
Then why were there so many accidents when "dumb" people got their heels caught in the steering wheel when high beam switch was moved from the floor to the steering column?
From: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#106]
16 Mar 2006
To: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#104] 16 Mar 2006
Hi Harvey,
The way I see it is the car companies got "nicer" (not smarter) to the "dumb" people. :)
I doubt anyone decided to engage in a personal crusade based on getting their foot pinched under a pedal when they stepped on it.........Even "dumb" people know when they do something "dumb".
From: basehorawards [#107]
16 Mar 2006
To: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#103] 16 Mar 2006
I have a framing hammer that has "WEAR SAFETY GOGGLES" forged into the head. I don't know if you could sue the mfr. for smashing your finger (If you can I will soon be a rich man) but I would guess that they have been sued for people getting nails in their eyes when they hit them wrong and the nail flew up rather than going down into the wood.
From: logojohn [#108]
16 Mar 2006
To: ALL
I am sure you can find more:
http://www.rinkworks.com/said/warnings.shtml
.
From: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#109]
16 Mar 2006
To: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#106] 16 Mar 2006
Not touching that one with a 100' pole.
EDITED: 16 Mar 2006 by HARVEY-ONLY
From: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#110]
16 Mar 2006
To: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#109] 16 Mar 2006
From: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#111]
16 Mar 2006
To: ALL
What I find utterly amazing about this thread, is the strenuous arguments being waged, by people with virtually no personal experience, knowledge or contact with the machine in question.
Instead, it's a general commentary, in sweeping terms, concerning frivilous lawsuits and end-user responsibility and accountability.
Considering my first paragraph, I realize it's impossible, for most, to address the heat press with specifics.
Whatever happened to manufacturer accountability?
By that, I mean, the all-too-familiar trend in most any industry, of a company providing unabashed lip service, in order to brush away the complaintant, as if the problem's been dealt with in any way whatsoever.
It's become such standard procedure, that lying's become accepted.
Doesn't fly with me. Never did; never will.
...................................................................................................................
The recently-launched poll, could have several sub-categories, such as:
1. How many people, who voted in the poll, own a heat press of any kind?
2. How many people, who voted in the poll, specifically own a DK20S?
3. How many people, who voted in the poll, did so, based solely on an emotionally-charged opinion, in either direction?
Answers to those questions would be very telling.
EDITED: 16 Mar 2006 by DGL
From: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#112]
16 Mar 2006
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#111] 16 Mar 2006
So put up an additional poll.
The added info could prove interesting.
You have not yet used up your poll quota, and I will extend it if necessary. :O
From: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#113]
16 Mar 2006
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#111] 16 Mar 2006
To me this this comes down to one question. Did you operate the press correctly? The answer based on your description of what happened is no. The press is designed for two handed operation. You have stated that Aron Knight has told this to you. Had you operated the press with two hands where the handles are, there would have been no injury, and no cause for any action or this thread.
Now to me that doesn't take a whole lot more knowledge to form an opinion over......I also looked at the design of the press in at least 4 pictures that have been provided, as well as listened to you Dave, and Chuck B. discuss the operation of the press in detail. I honestly feel that I can't possibly be missing anything, and I find it ironic that you would think that anyone that opposes your opinion couldn't be well enough informed at this point in the thread with all the details that have been bantered about.
You have yet to admit that you made a mistake when you clearly actuated the press with one hand. I think that in not admitting this that you are more guilty of misrepresenting what happened to your finger than Knight is of "lip service". They shouldn't have to modify their press over your injury, and had you not been in the position of running a forum that can have a profound effect on their reputation,.......They might have even told you so. Your use of this position to manipulate them to change their press because of your mistake is wrong. It's pretty much blackmail, either they change or you keep beating the drum for change based on your self inflicted accident....This type of manipulative behavior was displayed when you described your phone conversation with Aron Knight.
To me all the details that are necessary, are covered in the fact that you operated the press with one hand when it required two, and then tried to blame them for a bad design.
Personally, I doubt any more needs to be said. But I bet you can find something new to continue on about.
From: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#114]
16 Mar 2006
To: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#113] 16 Mar 2006
That is apparent.
[Sorry, I am in a cruel mood. (devil) I just could not resist, you left too wide an opening on that one.]
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