Full Version: Dahlgren Wizzard - ?????
From: UncleSteve [#1]
30 May 2004
To: ALL
I may have an opportunity to pick up an old Dalgren Wizzard. Would this be a decent entry level machine or just a "toy" to play with?
I know it is a small, self contained machine and supposedly excels at engraving pens and small items (or at least did when new).
What would be a reasonable price for one in "good" operating condition with extra belts?
From: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#2]
30 May 2004
To: UncleSteve [#1] 30 May 2004
Steve,
Is it an XL?
When I was selecting my first computerized engraving system (the one I continue to use) I was choosing between the Dahlgren Wizzard and the New Hermes Vanguard 3000.
I went with the 3000 for the following reasons:
1. Larger engraving area = 8x10, compared to Wizzard's 5x7 (I think).
2. Superior letter quality. Hands-down.
3. Vertical pen up/down motion, compared to Wizzard's "Gooseneck" action = better accuracy and reduced occurence of "nose rub" on engraved plastic.
4. Larger monitor, compared to Wizzard's 5" (?) screen.
5. Heavy-duty workholding vise, with ample depth = very important for holding a wider variety of items.
6. Better track record of reliability. I have friends who owned the Wizzard and some spent a considerable amount of time in the repair shops. My 3000 has been a workhorse, that has only been in need of repair twice since 1989. Once for a Z axis problem on the circuitry (transistor) and the other for a bad connector cable for the keyboard.
Total for both repairs (done by Q1E) = less than $300.
You should be able to get either a Dahlgren Wizzard or VG 3000 for between $1500 and $2500 respectively. Possibly less.
If you look into a VG 3000, be sure to get the machine with the workholding vise. The other model is a flatbed, limited in the range of items you'll be able to engrave.
Edit: If you'd be doing a lot of on-site engraving of small items, the Wizzard is much more portable. A single unit, as opposed to the 3-piece VG 3000. Much lighter.
David "The Stunt Engraver" Lavaneri
DGL Engraving
Port Hueneme, CA
EDITED: 30 May 2004 by DGL
From: UncleSteve [#3]
30 May 2004
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#2] 30 May 2004
Thanks for the response.
The price on the Wizzard will be about $100 plus shipping. I am waiting to confirm it is in "operating condition".
I haven't heard back from the person that offered it as to condition but he did say:
"I'm thinking it might be worth something to a collector (or factory refurbisher - like those listed in the engraver's web site) but I'm not sure it is going to help someone in business. I got it for the same reason you explained to me and it didn't help me (not even after buying a operator's manual)."
I asked if it was the learning curve or the equipment condition that was the reason it "didn't help".
My original "reason" was looking for something to get started in engraving on lighters, pens and small jewelry items.
From: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#4]
30 May 2004
To: UncleSteve [#3] 30 May 2004
Steve,
Depends on what the repairs might entail. Probably would be worth a gamble at $100, but I'd prefer a machine that doesn't have the "gooseneck" motion. Makes surgical positioning of a line more difficult.
Could be a good way to get your foot in the door.
David "The Stunt Engraver" Lavaneri
DGL Engraving
Port Hueneme, CA
From: UncleSteve [#5]
30 May 2004
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#4] 30 May 2004
From: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#6]
30 May 2004
To: UncleSteve [#1] 30 May 2004
I agree with Davis's post except for the #2, Superior letter formation. I feel the exact opposite of that.
I own a NH V3000, V3400, 2 x IS400, a Dahlgren Wizard XL, and a Wizard PC.
While the depth of jaws and smaller table do limit you in some big ways, the Wizards are great machines, I still have both and they operate virtually flawlessly, used every Christmas now. As far as maintenance costs, brushes and about every 5 sets of those a spindle motor. I have never needed another repair in nearly twenty years. [The XL was accidentally dropped down a flight of concrete stairs and the only damage was to two corners of the case. I got the PC cheap because it was in a shipping accident that broke the case and knocked the carriage out of alignment with the rails. Just standing it on its face and realigning the rails fixed it.
I do believe at this time that the best of the lot is the IS400's, but let's wait for another 15 years and see if they hold up as well.
From: UncleSteve [#7]
30 May 2004
To: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#6] 31 May 2004
Harvey, thanks for your input.
For $150 including shipping, I think I will take a chance with it.... just to get some experience and MAYBE make a few $$ in the process.
The seller says it does work so worst case I will end up putting it up for sale here or on eBay if it doesn't work out. Heck, the parts must be worth a couple of hundred if it works.
The only problem he is aware of is that the little monitor on the machine doesn't work but he uses a separate monitor with the system for the layout.
From: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#8]
31 May 2004
To: UncleSteve [#7] 31 May 2004
Yes those monitors did blow out at times if the filter on the fan got clogged for a while and not cleaned. Mine is the original with no problems. You can hook up an old monochrome monitor that uses an RCA pin plug and have it work fine.
I thought I had a bad monitor once, Wifey had cleaned the machine and turned the contrast down till nothing showed. On the right side of the machine in a little cutout are a few things, including a start jack to use a foot switch to start the machine on multiple repeat jobs, and a small plastic shaft that is the contrast control. Clockwise is more contrast. When you get the unit give that a try before attaching the external monitor.
P.S. I have a set of schematics for the Wizard XL.
From: Bob (ALLSPORT) [#9]
31 May 2004
To: ALL
Message 50.10 was deleted
From: UncleSteve [#11]
31 May 2004
To: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#8] 31 May 2004
Harvey,
Don't know if it is a PC or XL model.
Seller says it is operational so I think I will take the plunge and give it a try.
Gotta start sometime. I spoke to a tobacco store here and he asked if I will be able to engrave cigar cutters for gifts..... told him I didn't see why not. Let the fun begin! ;~)
Steve
From: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#12]
31 May 2004
To: UncleSteve [#11] 31 May 2004
The only thing to be careful of is the 'Z' setting. If you forget to set the spindle the workpiece distance, the baseline will shift. That is due to the rotational drop of the spindle rather than a vertical drop.
I believe that is the one big mistake made by the designers. Simply the spindle rotates about an axis which is on the left side of a circle, and the bit is on the bottom of the circle. Every .010 off in the height is .010 shift in the baseline. It could have been reduced by a lot if the hinge was in the right place. Still an amazing feat being the first computerized engraver made, (the original Wizard, not XL or PC.) The XL added an external cart for storage which does have some software problems. If you need to know those ask me.
From: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#13]
31 May 2004
To: UncleSteve [#11] 31 May 2004
Steve,
A functioning Wizzard, at that price, is more than enough to engrave lighters, cigar cutters, small plates for humidors, and trophies etc.
I think you're wise by taking this opportunity to get your foot in the door. You won't regret it.
David "The Stunt Engraver" Lavaneri
DGL Engraving
Port Hueneme, CA