Full Version: Ah....POLITICS
From: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#52]
8 Nov 2006
To: bobkat [#51] 8 Nov 2006
Bobkat,
Therein lies the problem. As an independent, I voted for some Democrats and some Republicans, based on their qualifications.
The tribe has spoken and what I and many others heard, is that the struggle of Red vs. Blue has overshadowed the Red White and Blue, which we're all solidly behind.
How about these people, regardless of party, take some time to do their jobs, which should be dealing with issues, based on the wishes of their constituency?
EDITED: 8 Nov 2006 by DGL
From: Dee (DEENA-ONLY) [#53]
8 Nov 2006
To: bobkat [#51] 8 Nov 2006
I have to go to work so I will reply to you later.
Dee
From: bobkat [#54]
8 Nov 2006
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#52] 8 Nov 2006
I'm all for that. The only way that will ever happen is to get rid of them all and start over, with term limits and other controls so they can't take over and ignore us like they do now.
From: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#55]
8 Nov 2006
To: bobkat [#54] 8 Nov 2006
Not really directed at you, Bobkat since you see the point already.
Learning from history we see that any institution over 100 years old has one thing in common, It has been altered in a way that keeps the people at the top, staying at the top.
How they managed to pass a term limit for the President is a mystery, now if we could only follow through with the others. We might lose a few good ones, but only a small percentage fall into that category.
From: bobkat [#56]
8 Nov 2006
To: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#55] 8 Nov 2006
Everybody claims to be so angry, disgusted...(insert your own word here), about how our government doesn't represent us. But very few people are willing to really do anything about it. Why don't we all join together and say this is what we want, and then get rid of anyone who doesn't vote for it.
1. We want affordable health care, border security, whatever the issue, and if we don't get it, we will elect someone who will get the job done.
2. Every issue brought before Congress gets a vote; yes or no, no crap burried in a 2500 page bill that nobody reads. No hidden porkbarrel spending, every vote is public record and transparent.
3. Term limits for everyone in Congress; no professional politicians, no "good old boy" networks to get in the way of doing the people's business. No "special interest" contributions. Anyone not voting for term limits, just signed their own term limit, since they will be gone in the next election.
4. Campaign finance reform. Why is it worth millions to get a job that pays thousands? Hmmmm....
I'm sure all of my suggestions will be studied and lost in committee for years and never come to the light of day; but guess what, all of the committee members would be looking for new jobs come next election....
This country is headed down the drain, and there are a whole lot of people who can't wait for it to get there.
From: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#57]
8 Nov 2006
To: bobkat [#56] 8 Nov 2006
The way I see it....The Dems Gave the "new" minority a great lesson in how to stifle the progress of the majority......
I figure we have an endless future of the government costing us loads and getting nothing done......... And yeah I'm probably a more optomistic person than most......
Frankly I'm disgusted with both parties. For the Republicans for letting the minority define their direction as a majority, and the Dems for dirty politcs that stifled progress............They all deserve each other....Unfortunately we the people all seem to be the real losers.
Get ready for a higher cost of living and higher interest rates....The tax man cometh.....................
Praying for a "real" old school, fiscal conservative presidential candidate of the future..........
From: Dave (MT_DAVE) [#58]
8 Nov 2006
To: bobkat [#51] 8 Nov 2006
From: GBengraver [#59]
8 Nov 2006
To: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#57] 8 Nov 2006
Dems dirty politics?
For the Republicans for letting the minority define their direction as a majority
What do you mean?
The majority of the people spoke yesterday. And what they said was very clear.
The indisputable truth is that the people spoke loud and clear yesterday and they said that the status quo is no longer acceptable.
The unchecked spending, no accountability, the corruption, the lies, the boondoggle in Iraq.
We have a $460 Billion dollar defense budget and we can't even outfit our soldiers with adequet body armour.
WHERE IS THE MONEY GOING???
The party of "less government" is a sham.
Your party line rhetoric about taxes, cost of living, "we are winning the war" etc. has worn thin with the voters on both sides.
At some point the over $8.5 TRILLION dollar debt has to be paid.
How are you going to pay for it??
That is a debt that has risen by over $3 TRILLION dollars since the "fiscally responsible" party took control in 2000.
How about allowing oil companies to gouge us under the guise of "free markets doing what comes natural" at a time of war and making obscene profits while forcing the elderly and poor to make choices between eating and staying warm. Party of morals. Bah.
If you want to talk about the "party of values and morals" we could discuss the Tom Delays, Bob Neys, "Duke" Cunninghams, Mark Foleys, etc., etc., etc.
Cutting taxes during wartime, so that the middle class are the only ones making sacrifices (unlike WWII when all Americans were asked to sacrifice).
And Bill Clinton who left a budget surplus when he left office gets impeached for lying about a b**w job.
Wake up and smell your own party, it stinks.
Today is a good day.
Greg
EDITED: 8 Nov 2006 by GBENGRAVER
From: Harvey only (HARVEY-ONLY) [#60]
8 Nov 2006
To: GBengraver [#59] 8 Nov 2006
I think this post will be non-controversial.
Both parties stink.
From: Cathy (METIME417) [#61]
8 Nov 2006
To: ALL
I don't know how to do the grayscale quote?!?
As an independent - I have to say this is the best quote!!!
My voting experience was neat in the fact that I dragged my daughter to vote for the first time. But I never had to show my ID I just walked up, told them my name, address and birthdate and was able to vote. I was in and out of there with no line, but aren't they suppose to see ID?????
So many thoughts - all I know is I'm a little sad today and I really wish I could think of a way to really, really get rid of a TWO party system.
That's all.
Cathy
From: Ward (STENSONENG) [#62]
8 Nov 2006
To: ALL
Tell all of the losers that the votes for their opponents "Didn't Matter". Tell them in Virginia that their votes don't matter. Tell Donald Rumsfelt and President Bush, the new power
to subpoena that the new Majority now has, "Doesn't matter" I'm willing to bet it matters to Pelosi, Cheney and Rowe. Mattering is a matter of the side of the fence your on when your "OX is getting gored".
Some of us are old enough to have been in school when they taught civics.
My high school civics teacher could teach from experiencee about the
development of government from WW I through the Korean War Era, having taught
over fifty years. and some of us paid attention, learned something, picked up principles
morals and ethics, or at least learned what they were about and how they applied to
government.
Is the message "It doesnt matter" progressive or regressive? Negativity, defeatism, apathy and sloth, not exactly the qualities you think of being entertained by entrapaneurs seems to be OK when it comes to voting. Or are they part of a political approach, a form of propaganda designed to keep people from voting or wanting to vote. (One of my istructors
taught that the ignorant masses had no business voting and could not be trusted with
governanace.) If that could be, then who would benefit from such an attitude? The wealthy, the powerful, the Corporations and Big Business are certainly in the minority so they must balance the scales by exercising power, politics, psychology and public opinion. If you know history as it applies to public relations, it just makes sense. Knowing what your own best interests are and promoting them is really just good business.
Ward
(Never to old to learn)
From: RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1) [#63]
8 Nov 2006
To: GBengraver [#59] 8 Nov 2006
I agree with you on several points...I'm fed up with the "new" republican party, and long for the days of the Regan Conservatives.....
I look forward to the future...It should be entertaining.........
It's our turn to bitch about the management...... (devil)
From: Dave (MT_DAVE) [#64]
9 Nov 2006
To: GBengraver [#59] 9 Nov 2006
GBengraver,
You are my new favorite off topic poster.
.
From: basehorawards [#65]
9 Nov 2006
To: bobkat [#56] 9 Nov 2006
But since when is it the role of the federal government to provide us with that?
I would imagine that if put under the microscope 90% of what the federal government does is unconstitutional. The powers and responsibilities of the federal go0vernment are explicitly spelled out in the constitution. Health care is NOT on the list.
Go to www.senate.gov and pick a bill, any bill, and read the "Interstate Commerce Clause" in that bill. That is the overused excuse for most of what is done by the feds. Reading some of them it is amazing how much they have to stretch reality to justify the bill. It would be a joke if it wasn't so serious.
We were making progress with original intent judges but with the senate now under democratic control that will come to a screeching halt. There is no way that they will confirm any judges that rule using the constituion as the basis. Rather we will only get judges who will look at the constitution and see things that are not there or will look at how people "feel" - not relevant. Or, even worse, look at the constitutions of other nations.
Private business and charities used to do a lot of what the federal government does now. And the did it for less money, more accountability and better. And people supported the ones they liked instead of being forced to pay for programs they we are opposed to on constitutional, moral or religious grounds.
The government that governs best governs the least. to paraphrase Thomas Jefferson
From: GBengraver [#66]
9 Nov 2006
To: Dave (MT_DAVE) [#64] 9 Nov 2006
Thank you.
Greg
From: bobkat [#67]
9 Nov 2006
To: basehorawards [#65] 9 Nov 2006
We are in agreement. The only thing I think the government should do on the healthcare issue is limit the amount of pain and suffering awarded in malpractice suits to bring insurance costs down.
I am with you; we have waaaaay to much government interference in our lives now. With the democrats in power, expect that to rise exponentially. They know what we need better than we do.
From: GBengraver [#68]
9 Nov 2006
To: bobkat [#67] 9 Nov 2006
So, in your opinion, the reason health care costs are so high is because of people who have been injured and maimed by doctors ineptness???
That doesn't make sense to me.
If they want less lawsuits, they should do a better job, make less mistakes.
When your car insurance, home owners insurance etc. goes up do you go to your boss and demand a raise because your insurance has gone up?
I guess you could try but I doubt it would get you too far.
Yet doctors and insurers claim the reason they have to increase rates and prices is due in part to the raising cost of malpractice insurance. That is absurd.
How many doctors do you see driving 15 year old cars or living in low rent apartments because they cannot make a living due to the cost of malpractice insurance?
0?
Health care costs are raising at more than 5 times the inflation rate.
Why? Not because of lawsuits.
Should only people of means have a right to quality health care?
As an American, I always felt that if I have been fortunate enough to have financial success as a result of my being able to take advantage of what this great country has to offer, I also have a responsibility to help those who are not as fortunate.
I am not even close to being rich, sometimes wonder how I am going to pay my bills, but feel very blessed that I am where I am.
There are alot of people alot worse off than me and I look at paying taxes as part of the cost of having the privilage of living in this great country.
Wow, I need to put my soapbox back in the closet. ;-)
Greg
EDITED: 9 Nov 2006 by GBENGRAVER
From: Dave (MT_DAVE) [#69]
9 Nov 2006
To: bobkat [#67] 9 Nov 2006
Your argument here reminds me of when I lived in an Ultra Conservative town in Washington where most of the people were growers of apples and cherries. The editorial pages and Letters to the Editor would be filled with the growers B*tch'n about all the lazy good for nothing bums on welfare.
Than when there was a crop failure the growers were crying in their soup wanting the Government to step in with $$$ for them and I would laugh like hell listening to them trying to explain that what they want is different from welfare.
I won't even get into the Government paying farmers not to grow crops.
From: GBengraver [#70]
9 Nov 2006
To: Dave (MT_DAVE) [#69] 9 Nov 2006
That is funny.
I'm a little suprised at how many Dems you Montanians have elected to the Senate thorughout the years.
I always thought that the western states tended to be conservitive.
Goes to show you what I know.
Greg
From: Dee (DEENA-ONLY) [#71]
9 Nov 2006
To: bobkat [#51] 9 Nov 2006
I am not smart enough to know how to solve the problems of the world and I am really glad it is not my job. It is my job to look at the philosophies of the candidates who are running for office and see if I agree or disagree. I have certain criteria that are important to me and if a candidate of any party shares those philosophies then it is my job to delve further into who they are and then make a decision as to who I will vote for. The government that we have recently had has not met my particular criteria.
Dee
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