Full Version: Who's small Rotary and why?
From: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#1]
3 Apr 2007
To: ALL
Dispite all the horror stories and knowing there not much money it, I'm going to start getting into trophy and plaques and am looking for a small rotary engraver. What have you got? any regrets?
I'm looking at the Vision 810.
EDITED: 3 Apr 2007 by DGL
From: PenTrophy (PENINSULATROPHY) [#2]
3 Apr 2007
To: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#1] 3 Apr 2007
Go for it. Best of Luck........
How big do you want to be........not the business, the diamond drag engraving machine? table, cylindrical (baby cups, bells, ..etc..jewerly?..)
You have a laser... why rotary?? they make laser aluminum? flexibrass?
Just want to know why you think you need a rotary machine/Diamond Drag to make trophies??
From: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#3]
3 Apr 2007
To: PenTrophy (PENINSULATROPHY) [#2] 4 Apr 2007
Hi Mark,
I like the look of a rotary made plate much better than when lasered. I feel the rotary looks much more classy and rich. As far as how much I want to do with it....just trophy stuff for now. I fell into a situation where I could do a lot of trophy/plaques and I want them to be first class.
From: Cody (BOBTNAILER) [#4]
3 Apr 2007
To: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#3] 3 Apr 2007
Tom,
To me, it depends on what you're familiar with.
I'm still very new to the industry, and was only familiar with Corel and Windows-based products. Learning the software for any rotary is an uphill climb for me....but my awesome XOT reps (Engraving Concepts) has been helping me climb that hill.
We have the XOT 912. The machine is built like a tank....no complaints. I find the software to be quirky and unstable (stopped in the middle of a job today, and wouldn't respond - had to restart my computer, interrupting jobs running on my Epilog laser).
Would I consider another brand? Only if the Brewer gang sold & serviced it.
From: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#5]
3 Apr 2007
To: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#1] 3 Apr 2007
I'll sound like a broken record to long-time forum members, but I place versatility at the top of my wish list for any rotary/drag machine.
Evidently, I'm not alone.
Since you attended the ARA show, in Las Vegas, you probably noticed a decided trend toward "Gift Machines" by most every manufacturer.
The Vision 810 will be fine for flat work, but will leave you flat, if you decide to expand your horizons to cylindrical and odd-shaped objects.
As will most flatbed models, from any manufacturer.
Fortunately, rotary/drag equipment is very durable and decent used machines are available.
From: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#6]
3 Apr 2007
To: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#5] 3 Apr 2007
David,
Your comments on versatility are well received, I wish I would have spent more time in Vegas looking at Rotary machines but my business had very little use for one until I fell into the opportunity.
It is funny sometimes how different a business turns out to be from the original plan. I'm just going where the business takes me.
From: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#7]
3 Apr 2007
To: Cody (BOBTNAILER) [#4] 3 Apr 2007
From: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#8]
3 Apr 2007
To: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#1] 3 Apr 2007
Tom,
I am a proponent of buying more tool that you need and growing into it as your budget allows.....
I spend considerable time at the ARA show looking at Rotary engravers...I think I saw everyone that was to be seen. I also had my entourage of experienced folk with me ( David L, Harvey & Dee and input from Roy Brewer) for guidance. Ultimately I decided on Vision because it represented the best "Value" to *me*. I ended up spending more than I had anticipated, ( actually didn't intend to buy any equipment at all), but I am now eagerly awaiting the arrival ( hopefully this Friday. Next Monday at the latest) of my Vision Max Pro. ( which by the way is listed under "Small format engravers" on the Vision webiste.
It will open a whole new market for me, as will yours when you decide to get one. With all that said, it would be a pity for you to get a machine that held you back once word got out that you were able to do diamond drag/rotary engraving.......so I guess *my* inexperienced ( in rotary engraving) opinion would be to look ahead, check your market and see if it might be worth it to take a larger leap, pocket book permitting.
I hope that made sense.....either way, it's just my two cents. Want change?
EDITED: 3 Apr 2007 by C_BURKE
From: Rodney Gold (RODNEY_GOLD) [#9]
3 Apr 2007
To: ALL
Laser engraved flexibrass or spectrum light , applied to a standard cheap bright anodised plate you can get from any trophy supplier looks a ton better than a rotary engraved plate.
I wouldnt buy a rotary at all for the trophy business. We do a TON of trophys and hardly use our rotary for ANY of it at all. Lasers can make far better awards and shorter work in engraving them.
Why get involved with an expensive machine when you dont need one?
We use a Roland pnc 2300a (egx 300) for the odd amount of trophy work anyway , that cost us like $1500. We have far more sophisticated engravers but they are best served doing more complex work than mere plates or unprofitable trophy engraving
Have a look at my site for ideas
http://www.tokerbros.co.za
The plates I am talking about are here
http://www.tokerbros.co.za/engraving_plates.htm
We use these as backings for the Laser engraved slightly smaller "appliques" and they are seriously cheap , I think they land us here at somewhere like us$ 5-6c each
EDITED: 3 Apr 2007 by RODNEY_GOLD
From: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#10]
3 Apr 2007
To: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#8] 4 Apr 2007
From: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#11]
3 Apr 2007
To: Rodney Gold (RODNEY_GOLD) [#9] 4 Apr 2007
Rodney, you have a real nice web site. Thanks for sharing examples of your work. Because of your input I think I'm going to play with more laser material before I jump into a rotary. Better to spend a couple of hundred dollars trying different laser material before dropping several thousand dollars on something I may not need.
The extra time will also allow me to research all the other things a Rotary can do and then be able to hit the ground running when I do get one.
From: BrianC (INKSQUIRTER) [#12]
3 Apr 2007
To: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#1] 3 Apr 2007
After adding a laser to my business in Dec. 05 I am doing more of my trophy plates with the laser. However, I have a Dalhgren Wizzard that I first started out with in 1990. It has been invaluable to my business. It is basically for flat items but I am able to engrave a lot of jewelry pieces on it if you are interested in doing carry-in items. I can also pack it under my arm and do on-site engraving...
I think the 810 would be a good choice........very portable.
You must decide on what you are going to be engraving before making a decision.....there is no sense buying an all-in-one machine if trophy plates are all you want to do. If I were looking for new equipment I would certainly be looking at a machine that could handle about everything including round work.
From: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#13]
3 Apr 2007
To: BrianC (INKSQUIRTER) [#12] 3 Apr 2007
From: Rob (AWARDZZ) [#14]
3 Apr 2007
To: ALL
I too fell into the "I'm only go to do trophy plates and plaque plates". Four years ago I bought a back up machine Vision1212,,,to go with my Meistergram 2412 and ULS 25.... looking back,, I wish I had of purchased the "all in one machine"... since that time 4 years ago, our local Things Remembered went out of business, Giftware, metal wine glasses started appearing in the engraving room and this cat is still trying to crank em out on a pantograph. I say if u can afford buy the all in one... CAUSE YA JUST DON'T KNOW
Just one opinion from the school of hard knocks!!
Rob Simpson
PlayAll Awards Engraving & Giftware
(on the windy frigid southern shores of Lake Erie)
Ashtabula, OH
From: Stunt Engraver (DGL) [#15]
3 Apr 2007
To: Rob (AWARDZZ) [#14] 4 Apr 2007
Rob,
I use a pantograph regularly, but only when there's no better, (if any) way to do a job.
Fortunately, I have access to equipment, through engraving shop clients, to cover any bases I can't handle on my own equipment.
If that weren't the case, I would have plunked down for a Gravograph IS400 Volume, Newing-Hall TLC350 or Xenetech GE long ago.
As you say, you never know what will come through the door. If a person buys a single dimensional machine, for a specific application, then discovers they don't enjoy that facet of engraving, their options become very limited.
From: Dixie2 [#16]
4 Apr 2007
To: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#1] 4 Apr 2007
Tom..
I have 2 Vision computer engravers, a small Wizzard, and a ULS laser...
The good thing about the Vision machines is that they can do a multitude of items.. I use mine for silver trays (I Hate Cermarc), trophy plates, small plaque plates, wedding items.. etc etc.
I run my laser pretty much 8 hours a day, so I can use my vision machines to do the "small" jobs.. it definitely keeps me busy during the day, and I make more money.. so I'm happy!!
Good luck with your choice.. you can't beat the vision brand.. I have had them for YEARS and no problems..
Dixie
From: Toni (TONI56) [#17]
4 Apr 2007
To: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#11] 4 Apr 2007
Tom,
I agree with you to on checking out more laserable material that you can utilize before making the jump to a rotary. We have 2 lasers & a large rotary. We make 99% of our trophy plates out of Gravolase brushed gold/black or Rowmark Flexibrass brushed gold/black. I purchase the material with adhesive on the back. Joe lasers the tag, vector cuts it, we peel & stick it on the trophy. What I don't like is the time involved cutting individual plates, plastic or metal with a shear. The laser makes it so easy.
From: LaZerDude (C_BURKE) [#18]
4 Apr 2007
To: Tom (TJGEENEN) [#10] 4 Apr 2007
Tom,
Ironically, THAT is what my initial intent was. To find something portable that I would be able to take conferences, trade expo's things like that......and I still might.....
But as has been pointed out, you can do anything you need for trophies with your laser, and more and more, the trophy plates are done on a laser anyway.
I personally prefer the look of a metal plate over the plastic alternatives, and you can buy them precut and shaped in various sizes..... and since you can take your laser on the road, well, it sounds like you are set.
Good luck