EARLY Political Straw Poll - Engraving Etc. Forum

From:	Stunt Engraver (DGL)	14 Feb 2007
To:	gt350ed	Poll 28 of 57

6016.28 In reply to 6016.26

Ed,

I'll bring it back on track by agreeing with those who say the eventual winner isn't amongst the three contenders Chuck listed.

I suspect it will be someone who climbs in during the later stages, after the early birds have sufficiently had the skin pulled from their bones. >.<

Newty is making noises about jumping in and I wouldn't be surprised to see Gore in the hunt before the dust settles.

David "The Stunt Engraver" Lavaneri
DGL Engraving
Port Hueneme, CA

EDITED: 14 Feb 2007 by DGL

From:	RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1)	14 Feb 2007
To:	Stunt Engraver (DGL)	Poll 29 of 57

6016.29 In reply to 6016.23
No matter if your right or wrong on your perspective on businesses and their power (and I think you're wrong)......I think it's still a cop out to give them a pass. It's nothing more than defeatism. You're blaming everything except for the people breaking the laws....When is it their responsibility for their actions? When do they get to be accountable for breaking the laws? Eliminate the benefits, and create an environment that makes it more pleasurable to stay home, or worth while to go through the steps necessary to become a real American citizen. They shouldn't be able to get any benefits of citizenship of this country if they are not a citizen, including constitutional benefits, housing, medical, financial, jobs etc......... No exceptions. The laws are already there.......They need to be actively enforced for two reasons. The first of which is to deal with the drag these people are putting on the system, and secondly for the security of this nation. Thanks, Brian Genrich Rallye Productions Inc. 1-800-236-2036 x112 Custom cut, or sheet stock Sublimatable metal, Screen printing, and other digital print services.

From:	RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1)	14 Feb 2007
To:	gt350ed	Poll 30 of 57

6016.30 In reply to 6016.26

Sorry Ed.....You're absolutely right............

Was just following it like a casual conversation.......

Thanks,

Brian Genrich

Rallye Productions Inc.
1-800-236-2036 x112
Custom cut, or sheet stock Sublimatable metal,
Screen printing, and other digital print services.

From:	Stunt Engraver (DGL)	14 Feb 2007
To:	RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1)	Poll 31 of 57

6016.31 In reply to 6016.29
quote: You're blaming everything except for the people breaking the laws....When is it their responsibility for their actions? When do they get to be accountable for breaking the laws? Brian, Are you trying to turn this into a Dick Cheney topic? :-) David "The Stunt Engraver" Lavaneri DGL Engraving Port Hueneme, CA

From:	RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1)	14 Feb 2007
To:	Stunt Engraver (DGL)	Poll 32 of 57

6016.32 In reply to 6016.31
quote: Are you trying to turn this into a Dick Cheney topic? Apparently you are......... I-) Wake me up when you have something interesting to say....... :P Thanks, Brian Genrich Rallye Productions Inc. 1-800-236-2036 x112 Custom cut, or sheet stock Sublimatable metal, Screen printing, and other digital print services.
EDITED: 14 Feb 2007 by RALLYGUY1

From:	LaZerDude (C_BURKE)	14 Feb 2007
To:	Cody (BOBTNAILER)	Poll 33 of 57

6016.33 In reply to 6016.16
quote: Gotta agree with Ed on this one....I don't think our next president will be any of the above. Clearly, I don't know. I don't know Cody. I think maybe it is possible. I believe that Americans are sick and tired of the same old political rhetoric. As Steve said, Edwards is already done before it starts. Romney is already back pedaling on things he said four years ago. McCain tried and failed once. Doesn't mean he could try and win. How many times did it take before Nixon won? And look what happened to him. B-) I think America wants change, I think, no I KNOW America wants out of IRAQ, and I believe that Americans don't want "business" as usual. As I said in my original post, this was just for fun. I should KNOWN it would stir a tempest :-$ but oh well...it is fun all the same. Anyway, I do think that the folks I listed have a good chance of going the mile. Remember Jimmy Carter ;-)

From:	basehorawards	14 Feb 2007
To:	LaZerDude (C_BURKE)	Poll 34 of 57

6016.34 In reply to 6016.33
quote: I think, no I KNOW America wants out of IRAQ While this is an accurate statement I do not believe that it is a correct statement. When the debate is framed this way the desire changes. Which would you rather have: Our soldiers fighting the guys who would kill all of us who will not convert to their form of religion over in Iraq? Or: Our soldiers fighting those guys on the streets of the United States? Iraq may not have had a direct and in 9/11 but neither did Afghanistan (the Taliban was never recognized as the legitimate government). However, Saddam Hussein was a threat to stability in the area. He was a supporter of terrorism - he paid money to the families of homicide bombers in Israel. He did attack Kuwait and if we had not stopped him there he would have moved west and taken over Saudia Arabia as well. (BTW the reason Bush 41 did not "finish the job" then was because he was there under a UN mandate that prohibited him from doing just that. So much for the wisdom of the UN.) Taking him out and drawing the terrorists to Iraq keeps them busy over there and not here. P.S. I think that the early polls have as much meaning as the presidencies of Howard Dean, Ross Perot, Ward Connelly and ... oh, wait, they were not even the candidates in those elections. :S James Basehor Awards & Trophies

From:	LaZerDude (C_BURKE)	14 Feb 2007
To:	Stunt Engraver (DGL)	Poll 36 of 57

6016.36 In reply to 6016.35
quote: What are the chances that a political topic could have turned into such an out-of-control maelstrom? :P oh if I had to guess David, I would say oh..about 100% B-)

From:	LaZerDude (C_BURKE)	14 Feb 2007
To:	basehorawards	Poll 37 of 57

6016.37 In reply to 6016.34

James,
I agree with what you said, however I think we could have gotten Saddam out without going in. I have ALWAYS believed that we could and should fight terrorism, but I do not think Iraq is what that is about. I think Iraq was about oil and "W" fullfilling his fathers objectives.

Just my two cents. Want change?

From:	basehorawards	14 Feb 2007
To:	LaZerDude (C_BURKE)	Poll 38 of 57

6016.38 In reply to 6016.37
If it was about oil we would have never left Kuwait and we would just declare Iraq a protectorate of the U.S. Who could stop us? (Other than ourselves?) James Basehor Awards & Trophies

From:	LaZerDude (C_BURKE)	14 Feb 2007
To:	Cody (BOBTNAILER)	Poll 41 of 57

6016.41 In reply to 6016.40
quote: Sure you do....I'm the fat bald guy. We met last year....don't you remember?????? :P OH! YEAH! NOW I remember. You were the guy that tried to pick me up on the corner in Vegas...Yeah! Now I remember. B-)

From:	Dave Jones (DAVERJ)	14 Feb 2007
To:	RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1)	Poll 42 of 57

6016.42 In reply to 6016.18
quote: 3. Iraq war. Let the military win on their terms, Don't hold them back for political correctness. Let them win the war...Don't send them home with a job half done unless THEY determine that the situation is hopeless. The war is over. We already "won" as well as we ever can over there. It's down to wild west style lawlessness now, and is a police action, not a war. A war involves having an organized enemy that you can defeat. Not a never ending procession of lawless individuals with loose affiliations between each other. They are not an army. They will never give up. They will never stop. We won the war when we defeated Saddam's army. What we're fighting now isn't an army. It's groups of people from inside and outside the country who don't want us there, and will continue to fight for 1000 years if we stay there. We can't kill them all and there is no organization to defeat. Go to any major city in the US and say that the police can leave their jobs when the war on crime is won. It will never be won. It can't be because it isn't a war. Calling it a war is just political rhetoric. Crime in a big city is a never ending procession of lawless individuals. So is the current "war" in Iraq. ...Dave Dave Jones Design

From:	RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1)	14 Feb 2007
To:	Dave Jones (DAVERJ)	Poll 43 of 57

6016.43 In reply to 6016.42

Hi Dave,

The end game/objective is peace and democracy in Iraq....Everyone knows if we leave now that will not be achieved. Only the military should decide if it's possible to achieve that end, and they should leave when they decide either they have won, or that they cannot win.

Don't kid yourself.....walking away will just give more zeal to those that want us gone.........and when I say gone....I mean from the face of the earth....not gone from Iraq. Ask the Iranian President about how he feels about America.........or Isreal.....That's the mentality that will fill the void if we leave. Make no mistake, we have far more to lose by leaving, than by staying until we get it right.

Thanks,

Brian Genrich

Rallye Productions Inc.
1-800-236-2036 x112
Custom cut, or sheet stock Sublimatable metal,
Screen printing, and other digital print services.

From:	Lisa (TROPHYUSA)	14 Feb 2007
To:	gt350ed	Poll 44 of 57

6016.44 In reply to 6016.10
I'm all about John Edwards! But the thought of Hilary for Pres makes me sick! Bad enough she made senator by buying a house in NY. Disgusting. Lisa R. Higginbotham www.5starawards.net Commit your work to the LORD, and then your plans will succeed. --Proverbs 16:3, NLT

From:	LaZerDude (C_BURKE)	14 Feb 2007
To:	Lisa (TROPHYUSA)	Poll 45 of 57

6016.45 In reply to 6016.44
quote: But the thought of Hilary for Pres makes me sick! Bad enough she made senator by buying a house in NY. Disgusting. Wait Lisa, Wasn't Hillary President already? ( insert laugh here)

From:	Dee (DEENA-ONLY)	14 Feb 2007
To:	Lisa (TROPHYUSA)	Poll 46 of 57

6016.46 In reply to 6016.44

Lisa,
I find it interesting that Hilary garners a great deal of respect from many of the citizens of NY. She is a brilliant women with a great deal of moxie. If she runs not only will she have my vote she will have a little bit of my money.

It is a good thing the Beach Party is about engraving & not politics!

Dee

Philadelphia, PA (Really Bensalem)

From:	Dave Jones (DAVERJ)	14 Feb 2007
To:	RALLYGUY (RALLYGUY1)	Poll 47 of 57

6016.47 In reply to 6016.43

The end game/objective was to remove an evil dictator and hand the country back to the people that live there.

We did the first part. We seem to have a problem doing the second part.

They want their religious leaders to control the government. But there are three opposing religions that have been at war with each other for centuries. By staying there we are not, and never will, bring them lasting peace. All we will do is unite the three religious orders against us. At least long enough for us to leave, and then they'll be back at each other's throats. So the only difference between leaving now and in another year or two is how many of our children we allow to die at their hands.

We tried to take peace and democracy to Korea. We tried to take peace and democracy to Vietnam. Peace came about there when we we forced to leave. Democracy is still not there.

You can remove a dictator from power, but if you try to force your ideals onto the people in another country, it won't last if it's not what they want.

...Dave
Dave Jones Design