Pricing Correctly / YAG vs CO2 - Engraving Etc. Forum

<body> <h1>Full Version: <a href="https://www.engravingetc.org:443/archive/index.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.68">Pricing Correctly / YAG vs CO2</a></h1><a name="a975_68"></a><p><b>From: precisionlaser</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.68">#68</a>]<br /> 23 Mar 2005<br /><b>To: laserman (MIKEMAC)</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.49">#49</a>] 23 Mar 2005</p> <p>Mike,</p> <p>I suppose I oughta jump in on this, since we own two of these lasers and this is what we do for a living. There aren't two beams. It's one beam, fired through an F-Theta lens (via galvo mirrors in a scan head) to a point in the glass at the focal point of the lens. Generally, you see either a straight YAG laser at 1064nm (near infra-red) or a frequency doubled version of it at 532nm (green). These lasers are generally diode-pumped by diode banks at 805-810 nm (very deep red), although there wouldn't be any reason I know of that they couldn't be lamp pumped. Believe it or not, the output power is less than one watt!</p> <p>The movement in the X-Y direction is controlled by the scan head to the extent of the scan field. If the image exceeds the scan field, most quality lasers have a moveable X-Y table to accommodate larger images. The movement in the Z axis is controlled by a large servo moving the scan head up and down as needed via a worm gear.</p> <p>Images are converted into point clouds (which are nothing more than a zillion X-Y-Z coordinates) and it's not unusual for an image to have over 100,000 points or more. Each of these points is variously described as a bubble in the glass, or a crack in the glass. The technical name for what happens is thermal ionization (don't ask me to explain that!). I just call them cracks, because that's what you get if you get too many of those little guys next to each other...a shattered cube.</p> <p>There's not really a heck of a lot of magic in this...these lasers have just been constructed for this purpose. I hope this helps.</p> <p>Mark</p><hr /><a name="a975_69"></a><p><b>From: laserman (MIKEMAC)</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.69">#69</a>]<br /> 23 Mar 2005<br /><b>To: precisionlaser</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.68">#68</a>] 23 Mar 2005</p> <p>Mark,</p> <p>Thanks for that description When I first saw those laser systems 5-10 years ago It was explained to me that they collide the beams to create the 3D image.</p> <p>I did think that is was true because of the way a yag can go right thought a clear object and mark the surface below.</p> <p>Now I know or they have changed these systems with new technology which I would not doubt at all.</p> <p>I remember one of the first lasers that did that was a 500,000 dollar system made in Russia.</p> <p>Ah how times have changed </p> <p>Thanks again I will correct my answers when people ask me how its done now I know.</p> <hr /><a name="a975_70"></a><p><b>From: precisionlaser</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.70">#70</a>]<br /> 23 Mar 2005<br /><b>To: laserman (MIKEMAC)</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.69">#69</a>] 23 Mar 2005</p> <p>The beam still goes through the glass of course. You can smell the scorched plastic (our lasers use LEGOs for positioning the glass on the X-Y table...most people get a kick out of that!) on our X-Y table after a long engraving session.</p> <p>I don't know how the early models worked, but if they did converge two beams, I wouldn't want to have to calibrate it...reminds me of the Death Star destroying that planet in Star Wars!</p> <p>Mark</p><hr /><a name="a975_71"></a><p><b>From: Stunt Engraver (DGL)</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.71">#71</a>]<br /> 23 Mar 2005<br /><b>To: precisionlaser</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.70">#70</a>] 23 Mar 2005</p> <p>Mark,</p> <p>I'd love to be the fly on the wall and watch your machines in action. Fascinating!</p> <p>David "The Stunt Engraver" Lavaneri<br /> DGL Engraving<br /> Port Hueneme, CA</p><hr /><a name="a975_72"></a><p><b>From: laserman (MIKEMAC)</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.72">#72</a>]<br /> 23 Mar 2005<br /><b>To: precisionlaser</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.70">#70</a>] 23 Mar 2005</p> <p>Mark,</p> <p>This is probably why they improved the technology. And now look where its gone to "LEGOS"</p> <p>What will be next?</p> <hr /><a name="a975_73"></a><p><b>From: precisionlaser</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.73">#73</a>]<br /> 23 Mar 2005<br /><b>To: precisionlaser</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.70">#70</a>] 23 Mar 2005</p> <p>Someone asked for more information about how lasers work. One of the best non-technical descriptions I've seen is here:</p> <p><a href="http://science.howstuffworks.com/laser.htm">http://science.howstuffworks.com/laser.htm</a></p> <p>Enjoy!</p> <p>Mark</p><hr /><a name="a975_74"></a><p><b>From: laserman (MIKEMAC)</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.74">#74</a>]<br /> 23 Mar 2005<br /><b>To: precisionlaser</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.73">#73</a>] 23 Mar 2005</p> <p>Mark,</p> <p>That was great Science 101. I certainly enjoyed that link</p> <p>Thanks</p> <hr /><a name="a975_75"></a><p><b>From: precisionlaser</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.75">#75</a>]<br /> 23 Mar 2005<br /><b>To: Stunt Engraver (DGL)</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.71">#71</a>] 23 Mar 2005</p> <p>David,</p> <p>I have a movie file (WMV) of the process, but it's way too big to post here. I'll see what I can do to post it on our web site so those who are interested can download it and watch the process. I have to admit that even after 2.5 years in the business, I'm still fascinated enough to watch the machines do their magic...</p> <p>Mark</p><hr /><a name="a975_76"></a><p><b>From: Stunt Engraver (DGL)</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.76">#76</a>]<br /> 23 Mar 2005<br /><b>To: precisionlaser</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.75">#75</a>] 24 Mar 2005</p> <p>Mark,</p> <p>Would love to see the movie. (Has the book come out yet?:-)</p> <p>That's the type of thing we're hoping to bring the forum members, either through sites such as yours, or by going out and filming the processes ourselves.</p> <p>I have a friend who does videography and editing, who's ready to rock :-)</p> <p>David "The Stunt Engraver" Lavaneri<br /> DGL Engraving<br /> Port Hueneme, CA</p><hr /><p>Message 975.77 was deleted</p> <hr /><a name="a975_78"></a><p><b>From: Jim (JEARMAN)</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.78">#78</a>]<br /> 28 Mar 2005<br /><b>To: logojohn</b> [<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.77">#77</a>] 28 Mar 2005</p> <p>My experience is that unpackaging/repackaging is usually more laborious that the actual laser engraving (or pad print/screen) process yet customers think it should be free. The usual comment is "Well, all you need to do is take them out of the box and put them back...How hard can that be". </p> <p>Someone still has to pay for the labor and we charge for it. Our policy is that if product arrives to us packaged only in open ended, loose fitting poly bags that we will not charge for packaging. Anything more that that gets charged for. If the engraving time is faster that the unpackaging time then we will always unpackage the product before it's presented to the laser. In the case of a very long burn time then we will unpackage and repackage, if possible, at the engraving machine. </p> <p>We have more personnel involved in unpackaging and repackaging than we actually have as engravers. I wish that everyone would give us product "bulk packed" and do their own fullfillment packaging. Decoration of product has a much higher perceived value than packaging and we can charge more per unit for it although our labor costs are roughly the same as for packaging.</p> <p>Regarding your artwork and your question about pad printing: Your single layer art is what we would use. If this job was pad printed on a 2 color station then the blue would still be wet when we tried to print the black on top of it. Registration is tricker but the end result is better.</p> <hr /><p align="center">Show messages:  <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.1">1-7</a>  <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.8">8-27</a>  <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.28">28-47</a>  <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=EE&msg=975.48">48-67</a>  68-78</p> <h4><a href="lthread_list.php?webtag=EE">Back to thread list</a> | <a href="llogout.php?webtag=EE">Login</a></h4> <h6>© 2025 <a href="http://www.beehiveforum.net/" target="_blank">Project Beehive Forum</a></h6> </body>